(09-14-2013, 08:34 AM)BumblebeeCody Wrote: I'm one of the more vocal people against the Wii U but I guess I can explain why in detail here.

The Wii U sucks:
1) One of the biggest problems with the Wii U, a games console...is the games. There are hardly any games. What I love about Nintendo is that they mainly focus on being a games manufacturer. While Sony and Microsoft are beating their meat to make their consoles and all-in-one entertainment center, Nintendo are mainly about games; with the addition of some apps but nothing too out the way. This is also a problem however. Since Nintendo are all about games, it means the main reason to buy the Wii/Wii U is for games, if there are no games, you have a very shiny brick. The Wii U (NOW) has maybe 5 games worth playing: Lego City: Undercover, Pikmin 3, Wonderful 101, New Super Mario Bros and...I can't think of a 5th one, then you have a problem. The Wii U has been out for nearly a year now, and they have nothing to show for it. That's worryingly bad. Terrible in fact. For a company like Nintendo to have little to no games on a console is pathetic.

2) Their first party can only hold out so long. Yeah, you can buy a Wii knowing you'll get Zelda, Mario and Metroid but that's no reason to buy the console. The diversity isn't there. There's only so many times you can play a Mario game and still defend it or play a Zelda game and realise you're just going through the motions(no pun intended). I'm looking forward to the next Zelda on the Wii U because it's apparently going to be a big step for the series, which is what the series needed. Skyward Sword is easily one of the worst Zelda games in the series that I felt disappointed by.

3) Third party...where is it? Nintendo have little to no support from third party developers. If it's not that, then companies back out of the Wii U. Games like Aliens: Colonial Marines(Yeah it sucked) are cancelled before even getting a chance to be released and other games like Bioshock Infinite are nowhere to be seen.
The worst part about third party is that any game that is a damn awesome game and made by third party(Wonderful 101) is obviously not going to sell. The Wii U has a small install base. Not only that but you have to hope that-that install base are interested in your game. Fair enough you can make Wonderful 101, but you're making for a console that isn't selling and you have to hope that those who did buy it will buy your game, which is why I'm saying "INB4 Bayonetta fails to even hit 1 million".
(That being said Platinum Games never sell so...)
Not only that but games from the PS3 and Xbox AREN'T being ported to the Wii U. We've seen Tekken Tag Tournament 2/Assassins Creed 3 and that's fine...but that's all. No other company is going to move over their games to Wii U. Why buy a Wii U when Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance is not coming to it...for no reason? Why not Ultra Street Fighter 4 for Wii U?

4) Nintendo suck at online. Fact. They just do. Whether Hardcore Nintendo fans(the Nintendo Defenders) like it not, Nintendo suck at online.
Online gaming really took off on console during LAST GEN with the Xbox 360. There's nothing wrong with Nintendo taking other companies ideas and incorporating it into their own console. We're nearly 10 years on from the Xbox 360's launch and we still have:
4a) -Basic friends lists
-No easy way of sending messages
-No easy way of sending game invites
-Hardly any level of social gaming
-No account system(this is easily the biggest piss take. If you lose your
Xbox/PS3/Vita, you have an account to recover and redownload you games or downloaded/bought content(films and music included)). The fact that Nintendo have NO ACCOUNT SYSTEM for the 3DS or Wii U is shameful, embarrassing actually. Lose your 3DS or Wii/ Wii U, oh well. No account system. Really Nintendo. You have the Wii U as a chance to redeem yourself over the Wii and you still make online a pain in the arse.
(Setting up games in Animal Crossing: New Leaf are tedious as hell which is why I never bother with it anymore) There is no option to host an open town. Just ask people to join, or add them as best friends to talk to them(stupid, why!?)

5) Timing.
Microsoft and Sony announce a new console with little to no details.
Nintendo decided to release the Wii U, but people like me are waiting to see what Microsoft and Sony have in store before putting money down on a Wii U. They bother offer more than the Wii U, so why bother buying one right away?

That's just a few reasons. I'm a huge fan of Nintendo but not a fan of fanboying it up and defending a company that's clearly made so many bullshit decisions and show a level of hubris that's almost insulting. It's not funny in the slightest that Nintendo made a console that's failing but they're brought it upon themselves. The name, the timing, the games etc it's their own fault.
So that's why people don't like the Wii U

There's actual legitimate reasons for why people don't like the Wii U and not because they consider themselves better or are console waring. I want a Wii U, but only because it says Nintendo on it. Why buy one? What does it offer that can compete with PS4 and Xbone aside from milking Mario and Zelda? I'd say this is a Dreamcast 2, but even then, the Dreamcast had games. Does anyone actually think the Wii U is a success at the moment?

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Ok I agree for the most part. But what about the 3ds? It was launched at 2011 and the 3DS was suffering just like the Wii U is until one game that actually boosted the sales of it. Super Mario 3D Land.

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Also next month is a release of games that will be worth it. Sonic Lost World. I have faith that game would be impressive. But think about it. If it weren't for Nintendo releasing their console earlier, Sony or Microsoft would have done that and you would criticize either one regardless.

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Ok so forget the Wii U for a moment but what about Nintendo as a whole? Why do some people mop around saying that Nintendo is for losers when they got franchises like Fire Emblem, Metroid , Zelda and Starfox?

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(09-14-2013, 09:09 AM)MexicanAnime Wrote: Granted, I'm being optimistic and hoping that the WiiU does get some better games. While I can see that happening soon (especially with Pikmin 3, Wonderful 101), that does not mean it's above criticisms nor does it excuse me for not being a big fan of the console (not that I really dislike it anyways).

(09-14-2013, 09:19 AM)BumblebeeCody Wrote:

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Ok I agree for the most part. But what about the 3ds? It was launched at 2011 and the 3DS was suffering just like the Wii U is until one game that actually boosted the sales of it. Super Mario 3D Land.

Exactly, the 3DS had an OK line up and had slow momentum throughout it's first year, BUT, during it's first year it still had games such as StarFox 3DS, DoA: Dimensions, Ocarina of Time 3D, Tales of Abyss, Resident Evil Revelations, Resident Evil: Mercenaries, Rayman 2, Mario Kart 7, Super Mario 3DS AND every single DS backlog ready to play WITH the inclusion of being able to play new DS games that year and onwards.
The Wii died after Skyward Sword and there wasn't any major release after 2011. So the Wii U had the Wiis (decentish) backlog but nothing new to keep playing while the Wii U was new. The 3DS already had a huge library and constant new release. This year aloe for 3DS has been amazing. Great titles.

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Also next month is a release of games that will be worth it. Sonic Lost World. I have faith that game would be impressive. But think about it. If it weren't for Nintendo releasing their console earlier, Sony or Microsoft would have done that and you would criticize either one regardless.

Completely agree. Timing is everything. Imagine if Nintendo didn't kill the Wii off 2 years ago but instead released the Wii U this year. It would give them time to add features we want such as an account system or better online. Not only that but release a huge library of awesome games at once making it a strong launch line up. But because they rushed out a console, they have nothing to show for it. A couple of games...and that's it. I'd say the exact same if it was Sony and Microsoft, but the PS3 and Xbox are both still going extremely strong with titles still come out for it such as GTA V in a few days. Those consoles are still very much important but Nintendo "killed" the Wii too early and that console had none of the third party titles that the Xbox 360 and PS3 have.

*side note* I was exicited for Sonic Lost World until I heard it was a Wii U exclusive, lost more interest when the gameplay came out and it looked like a watered down Sonic Generations with Mario Galaxy platforming (which we don't need) then completely lost interest when showed the stupid (gameplay-slowing-breaking) jellyfish powerups. Meh. Obviously not fact and just my opinion so if you're excited for it, that's cool.

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Ok so forget the Wii U for a moment but what about Nintendo as a whole? Why do some people mop around saying that Nintendo is for losers when they got franchises like Fire Emblem, Metroid , Zelda and Starfox?

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Because Nintendo live in their own bubble that stinks of their own fart. The make a console like the Wii and it's graphically under powered. Yeah people can bitch at me all they want, but the fact is, graphics do matter. If you don't give the developer the graphics power to make the games they want, you end up with watered down titles like Sonic Unleashed, Okami, Dead Space: Extraction or No More Heroes. Nintendo deciding to underpower the Wii was their own problem. It didn't have the graphical power and it was in HD. 480p is also pretty meh and I bought specific cables to make it look nice on a HD TV, but only by a small margin.

Now they've done the same with the Wii U. Released a console a year ahead of the others and expected developers to start making games for it. You'd think Nintendo would've learned from their mistakes but nope. We still have a generic shop. A basic level of social gaming between friends and sending message, no account system, hardly any games and I think, only 1 game with online.

All Nintendo do is pump out the same game series such as: Fire Emblem, Metroid , Zelda and Starfox and that's it. I'll buy a Wii U for them... and that's all it's good for. It's been a year and we haven't seen them. We're still waiting for a release date on Zelda WW HD and nothing else for the other games have been mentioned. We've got NSMBWii U, but one game isn't enough. Again, people may not like it, but third party is just as important of which the Wii U has none.
People give Activision shit for releasing CoD every year but all Nintendo fans are the same games and it's fine when they do. Why is that? The last new IP from Nintendo was Pikmin....10 years ago....on the GameCube.

(09-14-2013, 09:09 AM)MexicanAnime Wrote: Granted, I'm being optimistic and hoping that the WiiU does get some better games. While I can see that happening soon (especially with Pikmin 3, Wonderful 101), that does not mean it's above criticisms nor does it excuse me for not being a big fan of the console (not that I really dislike it anyways).

I agree. I think everyone should play Wonderful 101. It's bloody amazing.

I have to make it clear as well, I love Nintendo, but the Wii was a fad that relied on it's motion controls to sell, and it did. But after a year, it faded and then you just wanted to play games. I want to play a Wii U. I like the 3DS though.

Edit: Serious question(not a smartarse rhetorical question either)
To those who own a Wii U, how often do you play the system?

(09-14-2013, 09:49 AM)Artwark Wrote: Not to be rude here but what do you say about this?

Also how are you saying that graphics matter? If the gameplay is great, then the graphics will be great as well because they reflect the game mechanics. Yoshi's island had great gameplay and the gameplay is what presented the graphics of the game. The same for Donkey Kong Country. Rare wanted the gameplay to make a mixture of real and fun and the graphics are reflected to make them look gorgeous.

(09-14-2013, 09:19 AM)BumblebeeCody Wrote:

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Ok I agree for the most part. But what about the 3ds? It was launched at 2011 and the 3DS was suffering just like the Wii U is until one game that actually boosted the sales of it. Super Mario 3D Land.

Exactly, the 3DS had an OK line up and had slow momentum throughout it's first year, BUT, during it's first year it still had games such as StarFox 3DS, DoA: Dimensions, Ocarina of Time 3D, Tales of Abyss, Resident Evil Revelations, Resident Evil: Mercenaries, Rayman 2, Mario Kart 7, Super Mario 3DS AND every single DS backlog ready to play WITH the inclusion of being able to play new DS games that year and onwards.
The Wii died after Skyward Sword and there wasn't any major release after 2011. So the Wii U had the Wiis (decentish) backlog but nothing new to keep playing while the Wii U was new. The 3DS already had a huge library and constant new release. This year aloe for 3DS has been amazing. Great titles.

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Also next month is a release of games that will be worth it. Sonic Lost World. I have faith that game would be impressive. But think about it. If it weren't for Nintendo releasing their console earlier, Sony or Microsoft would have done that and you would criticize either one regardless.

Completely agree. Timing is everything. Imagine if Nintendo didn't kill the Wii off 2 years ago but instead released the Wii U this year. It would give them time to add features we want such as an account system or better online. Not only that but release a huge library of awesome games at once making it a strong launch line up. But because they rushed out a console, they have nothing to show for it. A couple of games...and that's it. I'd say the exact same if it was Sony and Microsoft, but the PS3 and Xbox are both still going extremely strong with titles still come out for it such as GTA V in a few days. Those consoles are still very much important but Nintendo "killed" the Wii too early and that console had none of the third party titles that the Xbox 360 and PS3 have.

*side note* I was exicited for Sonic Lost World until I heard it was a Wii U exclusive, lost more interest when the gameplay came out and it looked like a watered down Sonic Generations with Mario Galaxy platforming (which we don't need) then completely lost interest when showed the stupid (gameplay-slowing-breaking) jellyfish powerups. Meh. Obviously not fact and just my opinion so if you're excited for it, that's cool.

(09-14-2013, 08:55 AM)Artwark Wrote: Ok so forget the Wii U for a moment but what about Nintendo as a whole? Why do some people mop around saying that Nintendo is for losers when they got franchises like Fire Emblem, Metroid , Zelda and Starfox?

---

Because Nintendo live in their own bubble that stinks of their own fart. The make a console like the Wii and it's graphically under powered. Yeah people can bitch at me all they want, but the fact is, graphics do matter. If you don't give the developer the graphics power to make the games they want, you end up with watered down titles like Sonic Unleashed, Okami, Dead Space: Extraction or No More Heroes. Nintendo deciding to underpower the Wii was their own problem. It didn't have the graphical power and it was in HD. 480p is also pretty meh and I bought specific cables to make it look nice on a HD TV, but only by a small margin.

Now they've done the same with the Wii U. Released a console a year ahead of the others and expected developers to start making games for it. You'd think Nintendo would've learned from their mistakes but nope. We still have a generic shop. A basic level of social gaming between friends and sending message, no account system, hardly any games and I think, only 1 game with online.

All Nintendo do is pump out the same game series such as: Fire Emblem, Metroid , Zelda and Starfox and that's it. I'll buy a Wii U for them... and that's all it's good for. It's been a year and we haven't seen them. We're still waiting for a release date on Zelda WW HD and nothing else for the other games have been mentioned. We've got NSMBWii U, but one game isn't enough. Again, people may not like it, but third party is just as important of which the Wii U has none.
People give Activision shit for releasing CoD every year but all Nintendo fans are the same games and it's fine when they do. Why is that? The last new IP from Nintendo was Pikmin....10 years ago....on the GameCube.

(09-14-2013, 09:09 AM)MexicanAnime Wrote: Granted, I'm being optimistic and hoping that the WiiU does get some better games. While I can see that happening soon (especially with Pikmin 3, Wonderful 101), that does not mean it's above criticisms nor does it excuse me for not being a big fan of the console (not that I really dislike it anyways).

I agree. I think everyone should play Wonderful 101. It's bloody amazing.

I have to make it clear as well, I love Nintendo, but the Wii was a fad that relied on it's motion controls to sell, and it did. But after a year, it faded and then you just wanted to play games. I want to play a Wii U. I like the 3DS though.

Edit: Serious question(not a smartarse rhetorical question either)
To those who own a Wii U, how often do you play the system?

(09-14-2013, 10:58 AM)BumblebeeCody Wrote:

(09-14-2013, 09:49 AM)Artwark Wrote: Not to be rude here but what do you say about this?

Also how are you saying that graphics matter? If the gameplay is great, then the graphics will be great as well because they reflect the game mechanics. Yoshi's island had great gameplay and the gameplay is what presented the graphics of the game. The same for Donkey Kong Country. Rare wanted the gameplay to make a mixture of real and fun and the graphics are reflected to make them look gorgeous.

1)It's fine. It's not rude but a valid point. The only problem is that that article doesn't actually delve into the power of the Wii. It's a generic article that's not really for those into computer processing power(and it sounds like a PR article if anything).
This post here (which isn't about discussion) actually shows the Wii Us "power" and is well worth checking out.
The Wii U is able to output much more than the Xbox and PS3, but we'll see how it fairs out against the Xbone and PS4.

2)Graphics do matter though, but I don't think we're talking about the same graphics. I'm talking about graphic capabilities, not graphic style and we can use your games as examples:
What Donkey Kong Country looks like on Wii (480pish):

What Donkey Kong Country looks like on Dolphin (1080p):


Or:


I'm completely fine with the graphic style of games. But if the Wii had the processing power of the Xbox 360 and PS3, then we could've had games looking like those above. Hopefully you understand my point of 'wanting better graphics' and why graphics do infact matter.

(09-14-2013, 10:58 AM)BumblebeeCody Wrote: I'm completely fine with the graphic style of games. But if the Wii had the processing power of the Xbox 360 and PS3, then we could've had games looking like those above. Hopefully you understand my point of 'wanting better graphics' and why graphics do infact matter.